'Sai Baba, my god, dictated my every single judgment’
Are congratulations in order? Have you been appointed chairman of the Sri Sathya Sai Central Trust? Not yet. Let a formal announcement come, then you may congratulate me. Let them make a formal offer.
But you'll accept it if it comes? Of course I will. There is no reason not to. But that is a decision for the rest of the trustees to make.
The trustees seem divided between Sai Baba's nephew, J Ratnakar and his caregiver, Satyajit. But your election will not be opposed by anyone will it, given that you are one of the best legal brains in India and don't have enemies? That is true. No one will oppose my name. I have cultivated a reputation as the foremost legal luminary across the Commonwealth. Ratnakar is a relative of Bhagwan (Sathya Sai) and Satyajit is a staunch devotee. That is all. Be that as it may, there is no row over succession. How can anybody succeed God? Who succeeded Lord Krishna?
How did you meet Sai Baba? The association lasted decades, didn't it? Forty-two years. I first met him during my term as chief justice of the Gujarat High Court. The day was May 15, 1968. Bhagwan was in Ahmedabad, so I requested him to visit my residence. And he did. He stayed there for an entire day and that one day changed my life (weeps). I was so overwhelmed, I became his devotee forever. He accepted me and since then he has guided and inspired me throughout life.
Over time, you became very close? Yes, he nominated me to the central trust 30 years ago. The affairs of the trust revolve around the welfare of the poorest of the poor. Sathya Sai set up educational institutes, hospitals and water supply projects for the common man without charging a single paisa. Each facility is open to every member of society irrespective of caste, creed or colour. In fact, the Sathya Sai University is a deemed university that offers courses up to PhD level. It is recognised by the UGC.
Does it not have any quotas then, or reservations for VIPs, minorities or any oth er group? None at all. All admissions are based solely on merit. Also, our hospitals offer cardiac surgery, ophthalmological surgery, any kind of surgery, equally to all communities without charging a single paisa. Bhagwan believed that `manav seva is madhav seva' (service of man is equal to service of God).
You are considered one of the pioneers of judicial activism and public interest litigations along with Justice V R Krishna Iyer. Does that come within the ambit of devotion? Yes, of course. Judicial activism is not concerned with the letter of the law. You have poor people coming to your courts; you have destitute women, widows, children. You must administer justice under the spirit of the law.
But doesn't your passion for justice sometimes conflict with your belief? For instance, the Sathya Sai trust does not pay income tax. In 1980, it secured special permission from the government to avoid an audit of accounts. Public charitable trusts are exempt from paying income tax. And the accounts of the central trust are audited, so that allegation is not true.
Inmates of the ashram, particularly young boys, have levied charges of sexual abuse against t he godman. (Agitated) These are all baseless allegations. Bhagwan is a divine person, divinity personified. All these allegations come from interested quarters.
Did his persona rub off on you professionally, in any way? Every single one of my judgments has been guided and inspired by a divine hand (weeps). I believe in two entities, Krishna and Sathya Sai. I am not a devotee but a lover of Krishna. People may call me mad, and yes, this is madness. The madness of love. At the age of 11, I would run outside the house and weep for Krishna.
As a professional, each time I would sit down to write a judgment at 5 'o'clock in the morning, I was only writing what my god dictated. Bhagwan held my hand as I put pen to paper.
Everything that I have achieved in respect of the law, and people say I have achieved a lot, is owing to the guidance and inspiration of Sathya Sai Baba. There is no doubt on that score.
Several alleged offences committed by Sai Baba were never investigated. What is the point of investigation? (Agitated) Bhagwan is divinity personified, he radiates joy; millions worship him. He is a teacher of mankind.
An attempt was made on his life a few years ago. Some ashram inmates were k illed. I am not aware of this. I live in Delhi, so I have no knowledge.
What is the total worth of the assets of the trust? Is it more than Rs 40,000 cror e? I do not know the present worth.
Did you meet trust officials in Mumbai during this visit? I cannot remember. Maybe I did, maybe I didn't. I am not clear in my mind.
Rumours are afloat that Sai Baba passed away well before April 24. That his ailments and death were concealed to avoid chaos among devotees. All I will say is that his physical body was with us till April 24.
But the soul had left it? That I cannot say.
You may not answer all these questions but are you avoiding uttering a falsehood? I have never uttered a lie in my entire life. I may not answer a certain question but I will not give you a false answer.
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Are congratulations in order? Have you been appointed chairman of the Sri Sathya Sai Central Trust?
Not yet. Let a formal announcement come, then you may congratulate me. Let them make a formal offer.
But you'll accept it if it comes?
Of course I will. There is no reason not to. But that is a decision for the rest of the trustees to make.
The trustees seem divided between Sai Baba's nephew, J Ratnakar and his caregiver, Satyajit. But your election will not be opposed by anyone will it, given that you are one of the best legal brains in India and don't have enemies?
That is true. No one will oppose my name. I have cultivated a reputation as the foremost legal luminary across the Commonwealth. Ratnakar is a relative of Bhagwan (Sathya Sai) and Satyajit is a staunch devotee. That is all. Be that as it may, there is no row over succession. How can anybody succeed God? Who succeeded Lord Krishna?
How did you meet Sai Baba? The association lasted decades, didn't it?
Forty-two years. I first met him during my term as chief justice of the Gujarat High Court. The day was May 15, 1968. Bhagwan was in Ahmedabad, so I requested him to visit my residence. And he did. He stayed there for an entire day and that one day changed my life (weeps). I was so overwhelmed, I became his devotee forever. He accepted me and since then he has guided and inspired me throughout life.
Over time, you became very close?
Yes, he nominated me to the central trust 30 years ago. The affairs of the trust revolve around the welfare of the poorest of the poor. Sathya Sai set up educational institutes, hospitals and water supply projects for the common man without charging a single paisa. Each facility is open to every member of society irrespective of caste, creed or colour. In fact, the Sathya Sai University is a deemed university that offers courses up to PhD level. It is recognised by the UGC.
Does it not have any quotas then, or reservations for VIPs, minorities or any oth er group?
None at all. All admissions are based solely on merit. Also, our hospitals offer cardiac surgery, ophthalmological surgery, any kind of surgery, equally to all communities without charging a single paisa. Bhagwan believed that `manav seva is madhav seva' (service of man is equal to service of God).
You are considered one of the pioneers of judicial activism and public interest litigations along with Justice V R Krishna Iyer. Does that come within the ambit of devotion?
Yes, of course. Judicial activism is not concerned with the letter of the law. You have poor people coming to your courts; you have destitute women, widows, children. You must administer justice under the spirit of the law.
But doesn't your passion for justice sometimes conflict with your belief? For instance, the Sathya Sai trust does not pay income tax. In 1980, it secured special permission from the government to avoid an audit of accounts.
Public charitable trusts are exempt from paying income tax. And the accounts of the central trust are audited, so that allegation is not true.
Inmates of the ashram, particularly young boys, have levied charges of sexual abuse against t he godman.
(Agitated) These are all baseless allegations. Bhagwan is a divine person, divinity personified. All these allegations come from interested quarters.
Did his persona rub off on you professionally, in any way?
Every single one of my judgments has been guided and inspired by a divine hand (weeps). I believe in two entities, Krishna and Sathya Sai. I am not a devotee but a lover of Krishna. People may call me mad, and yes, this is madness. The madness of love. At the age of 11, I would run outside the house and weep for Krishna.
As a professional, each time I would sit down to write a judgment at 5 'o'clock in the morning, I was only writing what my god dictated. Bhagwan held my hand as I put pen to paper.
Everything that I have achieved in respect of the law, and people say I have achieved a lot, is owing to the guidance and inspiration of Sathya Sai Baba. There is no doubt on that score.
Several alleged offences committed by Sai Baba were never investigated.
What is the point of investigation? (Agitated) Bhagwan is divinity personified, he radiates joy; millions worship him. He is a teacher of mankind.
An attempt was made on his life a few years ago. Some ashram inmates were k illed.
I am not aware of this. I live in Delhi, so I have no knowledge.
What is the total worth of the assets of the trust? Is it more than Rs 40,000 cror e?
I do not know the present worth.
Did you meet trust officials in Mumbai during this visit?
I cannot remember. Maybe I did, maybe I didn't. I am not clear in my mind.
Rumours are afloat that Sai Baba passed away well before April 24. That his ailments and death were concealed to avoid chaos among devotees.
All I will say is that his physical body was with us till April 24.
But the soul had left it?
That I cannot say.
You may not answer all these questions but are you avoiding uttering a falsehood?
I have never uttered a lie in my entire life. I may not answer a certain question but I will not give you a false answer.
'Sai Baba, my god, dictated my every single judgment’
